Sloppy Joes Again
The Sloppy Joes saga continues; now it threatens to get thoroughly out of hand and rather sloppy, if you will. Recently, in my search for a simple, basic recipe for Sloppy Joes that recreated a taste I remember from childhood, I presented "Jeff's Sloppy Joes". Whatever it was that I was remembering, I knew that it was drawn from a Betty Crocker cookbook for kids that I had c. 1970.
Very kindly my friend Tim (at Son of Timatollah) located his oldish Betty Crocker cookbook and gave us the recipe for Sloppy Joes that he found there. It's a nice enough recipe although, along with Tim, I think that the celery flavors, the green pepper, and the hot sauce were later additions over my Sloppy Joes ur-recipe. (By the way Tim, that recipe for Open-Face Hamburgers looks quite yummy — thanks for giving it. Believe it or not, I've never had them!)
Now, please don't take me for a Sloppy Joe purist. At my advancing age I'm rarely a purist about anything, not even performances of Bach on original instruments. My quest has not been to establish, in any sense, the correct recipe for Sloppy Joes. Instead, I've been trying to recreate a memory of a taste and, at the same time, try to establish what was in the ur-recipe and how far I've deviated from it (as a matter of interest).
I don't mind at all, really, that most modern Sloppy Joe recipes can't leave good enough alone and get themselves all gussied up with all sorts of modern, adult-oriented ingredients. If ever there was a recipe ripe for quick and varied evolution, it's Sloppy Joes. Also, I suspect that most cookbook writers who feel an urge to include a recipe for this classic also can't bring themselves to include a recipe that's too simple, too retro, and not touched by their own hand in an attempt to update, modernize, or lower the fat.
Thus, I like mushrooms, and green pepper, and celery, and I expect that they taste great in Sloppy Joes, but they don't match my memory for childhood Sloppy Joes. (And — sorry Tim — the Manwich stuff never tasted quite right to me.*) Now, it's quite possible that green pepper was an original ingredient in my own ur-recipe and, not having any on hand at the time, I simply dispensed with it forever as a necessary ingredient. I don't know. The mists of time, etc.
Also, I'm not above amendments myself: I don't know whether the mustard was an original ingredient, nor the Worcestershire sauce, probably not the garlic, and certainly not the wine, but they round out the flavor in a way that I was looking for. Maybe I'll try my own gussying sometime — I wonder how anchovies and capers would taste thrown in?
But that still leaves open the question of what was in my ur-recipe and whether I remember it with any fidelity whatsoever. Then, that question quickly spirals down into the whole matter of Sloppy Joes recipes and the origin of the dish. Oh dear.
As befits anything so iconic and simple as Sloppy Joes, claims of its origins will likely be contentious. For instance, here's a excerpt from an article on the history of sandwiches (from In Mama's Kitchen):
H.K. Heinz in Pittsburgh says their research at the Carnegie Library suggests that the Sloppy Joe began in a Sioux City, Iowa, cafe as a "loose meat sandwich" in 1930, the creation of a cook named Joe…" Since ground meat, stretched as best as possible, was a staple throughout the depression, we will credit the creation of the sloppy joe to the general spirit of all people who use their imagination to make food taste good without cost.
I've read others who discount the rather obvious suggestion that it's named for some cook called "Joe". Some will let its origins lie in the Midwest but claim that it's named for Sloppy Joe's Bar in Havana, Cuba, apparently a favorite spot of Hemingway's. The Food Timeline's "History Notes: Sandwiches" believes its origins are more murky, growing out of any number of approaches to using ground beef that became popular in the second half of the 19th century.
They quote the Encyclopedia of American Food & Drink as saying
The origins of this dish are unknown, but recipes for the dish date back at least to the 1940s. It dates in print to 1935. There is probably no Joe after whom it is named–but its rather messy appearance and tendency to drip off plate or roll makes "sloppy" an adequate description, and "Joe" is an American name of proletarian character and unassailable genuineness.
I was also amused by their off-hand remark — filled with what I suspect was unintentional humor — that "The state of Iowa does seem to have a history of loose meat sandwiches". Now, there's a history to cherish.
As for recipe origins, they give the following, found in a 1963 McCall's Cookbook
- 1/2 lb ground beef
- 1 can (1 lb) beans and ground beef in barbecue sauce
- 1/4 cup catsup
- 3 hamburger buns, split and toasted
- In medium skillet, saute meat, stirring, until it loses its red color.
- Add beans and catsup, mixing well. Simmer, uncovered, 5 minutes. Spoon mixture over buns.
Pretty basic and un-gussied, but what's going on with that can of beans and ground beef in barbecue sauce? Yuck!#
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* By the way, for those who need basic Sloppy Joes training, there is a YouTube video, featuring one Kit Traynor, called "How to Make Sloppy Joes". He uses the "Sloppy Joes mix", which I don't really approve of (because it tastes off to me), and his kitchen technique leaves some things to be desired, but at least he's enthusiastic about his subject. He also seems to think that "Sloppy Joe" is the singular form of the name, but I incline to the opinion that this is a faulty back-formation and that can either eat a single Sloppy Joes or multiple Sloppy Joes, but I don't feel fanatical about it.
#Oddly enough, the McCormick spice people, who make a "Sloppy Joes Seasoning Mix" (hardly necessary, in my opinion, and not only because the principle ingredient is sugar), have a number of pages suggesting uses for the product. One, called On the Go Sloppy Joe suggests adding a can of pork & beans, apparently without irony considering the name of the recipe. That recipe also calls for mustard as an ingredient, for "a little kick".
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on Thursday, 28 June 2007 at 20.19
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You are not going to believe this.
I didn't realize you were referring to the Betty Crocker Cookbook for Boys and Girls (Betty Crocker's New Boys and Girls Cookbook). I still have mine.
So I'm looking through the sandwich section. No Sloppy Joes. I look it up in the index. Sloppy Joes, page 46. Page 44: Hamburgers; page 47, Frankfurters. Pages 45 and 46 are missing!
I am so sorry. I had hoped to scan the recipe for you. I had no idea those pages were missing. I found the cookbook at my mom's when we helped her move to assisted living. It was a treasure of mine as a kid.
And I know this is silly, but I had crushes on the boys, or the images of the boys, whose comments accompanied the recipes. Especially "Eric."
I think I posted once on soc.motss about this, even uploading some images to our old RoadRunner website. They're relatively tiny. I'd have to scan again for recipes like Castle Cake or Rocket Salad. Actually, the Chocolate Fudge recipe was pretty good, and my cookbook has the scars to prove it.
on Thursday, 28 June 2007 at 22.49
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So near and yet so blasted far! How can pages 45 and 46 be missing! Obviously, there is a conspiracy at work. And yes, that was the cookbook I was thinking of.
I can't say I remember having crushes on the boys, although this might be the origin of my special feelings about the name "Eric".
Once, for my own birthday, I made that Castle Cake. What a pain in the tush that was. Perhaps it tasted fabulous, but all I remember was how much effort it took.
Say, now that you mention it, that fudge recipe — also simple and non-gussied — was the one that I always, always used, and it was excellent.
on Thursday, 28 June 2007 at 22.51
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Haven't had sloppy joes in a long, long time and never preferred them to a good burger. Not that I ran from the table on the infrequent occasions when they were on the menu at home. At school was another matter.
A really good rendition, the ones we had at home, had no beans, but did employ a slice or two of Bermuda onion, diced, Worcestershire sauce and instead of catsup, Heinz Chili Sauce. Be advised, if you're not familiar with it, that Heinz Chili Sauce is a catsup-like product, thicker, more spicy, with a distinctive flavor all its own. But that flavor is nothing like Mexican chili.
BTW, Heinz Chili Sauce is excellent for putting on top of a meatloaf in the final 20 minutes or so of its oven interlude.
on Friday, 29 June 2007 at 04.27
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You made the Castle Cake for your birthday? I made it once, too, maybe for my birthday. I wish there were pictures.
on Tuesday, 3 July 2007 at 20.59
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When I went to college in Iowa City, there was still a restaurant – The MaidRight – that served "Loose Meat Sandwiches." They were yummy.
on Monday, 9 July 2007 at 00.34
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Tim: now that you mention pictures, I believe that I remember there being pictures of me and my castle cake. It may take a few years, but I'm sure they'll turn up sometime. Maybe I can get my father to go through some of those shoe boxes of photos.
Ellen: I'm envious. I, too, went to college in Iowa and I never got to experience "Loose Meat Sandwiches", probably because I didn't get out much. I did, however, once have a "Scrambolea" at the all-night diner in Cedar Rapids.
on Monday, 1 October 2007 at 18.17
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In my search on the web for a recipe for Sloppy Joes, I found your site. The Betty Crocker's New Boys and Girls Cookbook is for sale on Ebay right now (the vintage one you are speaking about).